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+---- Thread: LR: Japanese-Style Rules (/showthread.php?tid=1924)
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LR: Japanese-Style Rules - NiX - 08-27-2009
Rick showed me the rules for LR employed by the Japanese community (via Momo's site)
Just posting this here as a comparison to our own rules. Although it would honestly be interesting to have a tourney with these parameters.
Might be too late for that now though. Quote:Google Translation:
▼ ACLR Regulation Vr.1.1 ▼
＜対戦形式＞ "Game format"
・スイスドロー４回戦以上、上位４名以上のエリミネーションマッチ ・１機制、１試合５分２本先取（引き分けを含む最大３回戦） · Suisudoro least four round, the top four aircraft Erimineshonmatchi more than one system, two duck first five minutes of this one (including a maximum of 3 first round tie.)
・相手の情報表示をOFFにしての対戦 ・紹介ムービーはスキップ不可。 OFF · other information displayed on the game and the movie is not about skipping.
・土遁行為、反則行為、暴行行為は敗北とします。 · Act Myongjigeogari soil, foul, and defeat the violent act.
＜対戦マップ＞ "Map game"
・以下のMAPよりランダムで選択。 Randomly selected from the following · MAP. （重複なし） (No Duplicates)
01.AC GARAGE 01.AC GARAGE
02.HIGHLANDS 02.HIGHLANDS
03.SPACEPORT 03.SPACEPORT
04.BARN ARENA 04.BARN ARENA
05.MILITARY DISTRICT 05.MILITARY DISTRICT
06.RUIN 06.RUIN
07.ABANDONED FACTORY 07.ABANDONED FACTORY
08.MARINE BASE 08.MARINE BASE
09.BORN CITY 09.BORN CITY
・タンク・フロート機は、事前に上記より除外するマップを３つ選択できる。 · Aircraft float tank, a map can be excluded from the above three pre-select one.
＜制限事項＞ "Limitations"
・装備禁止 ECMメーカー全種 CR-WR73RS...（タンクは可能） ECM equipment manufacturers prohibit all kinds · CR-WR73RS ... (tank is available)
CR-WH01HPを格納出来ない...（タンクは可能） CR-WH01HP not store ... (tank is available)
・ブースター制限 B83TP・VULTURE・VULTURE2・GULL・B90T2の装備不可。 · Limit booster B83TP · VULTURE · VULTURE2 · GULL · B90T2 not equipment.
中量二脚・重量二脚は、更にBIRDIE2を装備できない。 Amount of weight during the two legs two legs are not equipped with BIRDIE2 further.
Same thing, babelfish translation
▼ACLR Regulation Vr.1.1▼
< Opposition type >
[suisudoro] 4 above game and the elimination match superior 4 or more
1 machine systems, 1 tournament 5 minute 2 these preoccupation (the maximum of 3 games which include draw)
Opposition turning the information display of the partner to a OFF
Introduction as for movie skip failure.
Earth 遁 behavior, infringement behavior and assault behavior make being defeated.
< Opposition map >
From MAP below it selects with random. (There is no repetition)
01.AC GARAGE
02.HIGHLANDS
03.SPACEPORT
04.BARN ARENA
05.MILITARY DISTRICT
06.RUIN
07.ABANDONED FACTORY
08.MARINE BASE
09.BORN CITY
Tank float the machine can select 3 maps which are excluded from description above in advance.
< Restriction item >
Equipment and prohibition
ECM manufacturer all kind
CR-WR73RS…(The tank is possible)
CR-WH01HP cannot be housed,…(The tank is possible)
Booster restriction
The equipment failure of B83TP VULTURE VULTURE2 GULL B90T2.
The medium quantitative bipods weight bipods furthermore cannot equip BIRDIE2.
A pain to read, yeah? But just showing you that they play a different game.
Here's a summary from what I understood:
ecms - banned
RS - tanks only
HP - can't be hangered except if you're a tank
TP, Vulture, Vulture2, gull, T2 - yep none of them can be equipped.
Can't understand the birdie2 thing, but I think it's saying that underweighted ACs can't use Birdie2.
Basically, they're playing a MUCH slower game. I'm not exactly sure why they opted for this though. Maybe to level things better for tanks and hovers? To increase the value of OB? To counter LR's inherent inaccuracy? I'm not really sure. But it's a big contrast to the rules used by the english-speaking community. It's all very interesting.
What I really liked is the ability to thumb down maps though. We should have used something like that ever since.
Your thoughts?
RE: LR: Japanese-Style Rules - Grim - 08-28-2009
(08-27-2009, 11:58 PM)NiX Wrote: Your thoughts?
We should try this out, as soon as possible.
It looks very interesting. I wonder what boosters the majority of them equip after they take out 3-4 of the best choices. You're right, that is one slow game. The banning of RS for everything except tanks supports that too. I think they did it so RL shots can actually hit now.
RE: LR: Japanese-Style Rules - NiX - 08-28-2009
Mix, they're all using B81 or Birdie2.
If it's to meet up just to casually play AC, I'm game for that any time of the week. Any freaking time.
RE: LR: Japanese-Style Rules - maitreya - 08-28-2009
Mmm.. I wonder how minisawa would fare? And Barn Arena? Haha. Nice
RE: LR: Japanese-Style Rules - NiX - 08-28-2009
Yeah really funky rules. But I'm imagining that if the pace is really slow, Barn Arena WOULD make for some funny peek-a-boo games.
And I really like that Hovers and Tanks can thumb down 3 maps from the selection.
Pretty much all my tank designs fit into their rules.
This'll make tanking even more fun than ever! *evil laugh*But on second thought, the prevalence of high-accel BIRDIE2 designs might still make for some wonky accuracy. We'll see.
RE: LR: Japanese-Style Rules - Penguin Deus - 08-29-2009
I gotta say I'm not a fan of those rules at first look. It sorta seems like they are trying to make the game closer to NX and NB, in terms of speed and dominant archetypes. These rules to me would expound on a lot of the game's inherent issues, and they really really favor tanks harder than PACT or US rules. really surprising stuff.
I'd certainly be willing to give them a shot, though. Doesn't hurt to try.
The more I think about it the more I think it really shows the differences in how we view "balance" relative to the Japanese players. They seem to want more of an even-across-the-boards statwise approach whereas we like to have balance through posing multiple variables and forcing adjustment. I think even stuff as seemingly small and insignificant as their approach to map choice illustrates this. They use random for maps, we use selection for maps.
RE: LR: Japanese-Style Rules - NiX - 08-29-2009
I'm thinking that tanks didn't need this much help in LR. And with the booster restrictions, I'm imagining that they'd seriously rape. Oh, but wait a minute. HARPY2's still allowed. GG tanks.
This definitely makes Hovers more appealing to use too. They'll be zipping around everything. Until they break of course.
RE: LR: Japanese-Style Rules - Sforza - 08-29-2009
(08-29-2009, 12:32 PM)NiX Wrote: I'm thinking that tanks didn't need this much help in LR. And with the booster restrictions, I'm imagining that they'd seriously rape. Oh, but wait a minute. HARPY2's still allowed. GG tanks.
This definitely makes Hovers more appealing to use too. They'll be zipping around everything. Until they break of course.
What I was thinking: This set of rules seems to exist just to make hovers feasible in tournaments where multiple designs can be used.
RE: LR: Japanese-Style Rules - Penguin Deus - 08-30-2009
I am inclined to agree with you Sforza. I think one of the factors in their ruleset was specifically to give tanks much less speed handicap and give hovers a much greater speed advantage.
Also, I honestly wouldn't fear harpy2 under these rules if I was in a tank. I'd be all over people's shitty booster using asses with my rs and hangared hps before they could finish getting the first set of 6 out. GG japbot!
Oh, and as an aside, in the US anyways we didn't ban harpy2 because it auto-kills tanks (altho that is part of it). We banned them because the unit has way too much ammo and leaving it in typically mucks up the metagame. We were seeing way too many cases of people just throwing orbits an entire match.
RE: LR: Japanese-Style Rules - NiX - 09-01-2009
Yeah, it's basically
1. Give tanks ability to keep up
2. Emphasize speed of hovers, possibly to make up for their eventual breakage.
3. Make things more accurate in general.
Just all shows how though we're playing the same game, the metagame's definitely different depending on where it's played and who's playing it. Bottom line is that if the rules are agreed upon by an entire community and it works for them, then it's all good. It just really makes for some interesting comparison.
Can't wait to try some of my tank designs on ACs built around these parameters.
-----
If you're wondering how some of their ACs look like, check here:
http://homepage3.nifty.com/momogure/event/ac/20071222aclr.htm
http://homepage3.nifty.com/momogure/event/ac/20071124aclr.htm
http://homepage3.nifty.com/momogure/event/ac/20080209aclr.htm
RE: LR: Japanese-Style Rules - atdsutm - 09-01-2009
accuracy based weapons will be mid tier instead of being high tier. burst damage weapon would probably rule in this rules.
RE: LR: Japanese-Style Rules - Penguin Deus - 09-02-2009
I don't think high-acc weapons would lose value. Consider that the speeds are all roughly the same from bot to bot, and LR still has a primarily defensive metagame. Also, the two things that gain in speed from these rule swaps (hovers and tanks) still get mashed by high-acc weapons. Hovers because it's guarenteed damage against the fastest targets, and tanks because backpedalling is still the #1 tactic in LR.
At the risk of over-generalizing, these rules basically turn the game into NX/NB. This is opposed to PACT/US rules, which strive to make the game closer to SL.
EDIT: Just realized I said "make the game closer to LR" which makes no real sense. Fixed!
RE: LR: Japanese-Style Rules - Serene - 09-02-2009
I liked the way boosters are made limited. Makes it easier for tanks to lock on even at least by a little. And in a way, reduce the speed hovers already have.
Balance in speed... Try this out and incorporate into the PACT Restrictions?
RE: LR: Japanese-Style Rules - NiX - 09-02-2009
Ei PD, why don't you try this out with TM or someone when you get the chance? We'll try it out one time too. Not that I want to use these rules for an actual tournament.
RE: LR: Japanese-Style Rules - Penguin Deus - 09-02-2009
I can't, though. There isn't really anyone to play in the area anymore worth playing and Owen lives a few states over from me. If I'm ever in Texas than sure thing. I don't expect to be out there anytime soon though. Not until later in the NBA season, if at all.
Sorry.